Connzi machell
Member
^^like
aren't u selling to Moonwalk any more?
aren't u selling to Moonwalk any more?
Why american brand do not use a distribution system
- Thread starter Johann
- Start date
how would it make prices drop? It costs lucky nothing to sell direct apart from a $20 website hosting plan, they cannot afford to cut prices at the moment they tol me themselves. So for instance a deck sells to dealer from lucky at £100 who sells it to customer at £140. If they have a distributor in the UK the deck may cost them £95 as shipping will be lower on bigger quantities but then the distributor will put his mark up on so it will go to dealers at maybe £120-£120 so then it goes to the customer at £170. All this does is help a distributor make money and make it longer for parts get to dealers as lucky already working flat out to make stuff. There are no huge american makers to run distribution in other countries TSI, Lucky and Phoenix are top companies making quality parts like aston martin and ferrari in the car world they cannot work in the same way as people like razor and madd do as they are the fords of the world, they get there parts made in the cheapest places (china) and then get them sent by factories directly that make them direct to the distributors in those countries to sort out. Lucky, Phoenix tsi make the parts themselves that costs money up front and have to post out themselves to shops distributors or whoever, Phoenix now distribute in the UK and the decks are £180 without a brake because of this instead of £120 if you buy them direct from USA so total waste of time, making Phoenix look overpriced when they are not and meaning people just but from usa shops and save £60. Look at PROTO same thing they go through skatehut and Orion deck is £225 in the uk thats $365! Or you can order direct from USA and get one for $250 + $30 shipping saving $85 (which is what the distirbutor is adding on top for their own profit) I probably dont get the point he is making still, I just own a scooter company, deal with all the big brands, have been helping to try to get people set up as distributors for big brands as well as our own products around the world so no doubt have no idea how it all works! You just have to allow that not all scooters companies are not the same the same as car companies motorcycle companies etc and it is only cheaper for customers to use distributors when you can make high volume products because of the large orders they can give you, if you cnc machine stuff like lucky or do a lot of hand made things like TSI it is not a good idea, now TSI have extruded decks like Phoenix it may change. The key point to remember is most companies use distributors to keep it cheap for them as they dont have to carry stock and not to save the end customers money, adding another middle man where none is needed isnt a good way to keep prices down and that is why Rider run companies Like TSI and Lucky do not do it as they try to offer the best products direct to riders at the best prices .
ztkAZ
Member
TSI is no where near one of the top compnays.
it's way to long to answer deep, since i already know that lol
Fist of all, dont tell that phoenix is the Ferrari of scooter lol
I just heard that they are made in YongKang, China
just tellin and this area is know for its " bad quality and cheap price " but still that's just what i heard
Sure theirs is bad factory in china, but their's also good ones, and exellent one.
You should know that Iphone and all the apple product are made in China (Iphone, MacBook..) as are Audi or Mercedez cars, nike and adidas shoes .. Just tellin again.
a worldwide distributor is useless since all the market (Aus, Eur, USA) have different thinking so customers have different wishes. So it's way better for companies to have one distributor per continent, it's easyer to control and to develop.
And how can you be sure to control and handle the development of you company when you know that theires is already 150 shops in the UK, 150 in France that already sell freestyle scooterparts ? (Not talking about Spain, Swiss and CZ rep)
It's just being blind (or close minded)
Distributor is putting its mark on each scooterpart. Thats obvious.
But the Distributor HAVE TO sells all those products, so the distributor adverstise and promote the company to be sure he'll get the money and make his own going well.
By this way the company is SURE to sell a minimum quantity (if the quality is good enought) AND it'll have a better promotion in different places. So if the promotion and feedback are good, market will increase.
So distributor is keeping the market safe and the company healthy.
We all know that CNC is expensive and fucking slow, but to be honnest, when you dont know shit about industry it's the first thinking that enter in your mind.
So it's just a bad choice by the company since the beginin and mostly a miss of knowledge. Since you know and understand that industry and technology is running the world, you know and understand that everything is not cnc haha So prices cannot be an excuse when it's "just" a miss of knowledge haha
Fist of all, dont tell that phoenix is the Ferrari of scooter lol
I just heard that they are made in YongKang, China
just tellin and this area is know for its " bad quality and cheap price " but still that's just what i heard Sure theirs is bad factory in china, but their's also good ones, and exellent one.
You should know that Iphone and all the apple product are made in China (Iphone, MacBook..) as are Audi or Mercedez cars, nike and adidas shoes .. Just tellin again.
a worldwide distributor is useless since all the market (Aus, Eur, USA) have different thinking so customers have different wishes. So it's way better for companies to have one distributor per continent, it's easyer to control and to develop.
And how can you be sure to control and handle the development of you company when you know that theires is already 150 shops in the UK, 150 in France that already sell freestyle scooterparts ? (Not talking about Spain, Swiss and CZ rep)
It's just being blind (or close minded)
Distributor is putting its mark on each scooterpart. Thats obvious.
But the Distributor HAVE TO sells all those products, so the distributor adverstise and promote the company to be sure he'll get the money and make his own going well.
By this way the company is SURE to sell a minimum quantity (if the quality is good enought) AND it'll have a better promotion in different places. So if the promotion and feedback are good, market will increase.
So distributor is keeping the market safe and the company healthy.
We all know that CNC is expensive and fucking slow, but to be honnest, when you dont know shit about industry it's the first thinking that enter in your mind.
So it's just a bad choice by the company since the beginin and mostly a miss of knowledge. Since you know and understand that industry and technology is running the world, you know and understand that everything is not cnc haha So prices cannot be an excuse when it's "just" a miss of knowledge haha
Read again the meaning of DISTRIBUTOR.
And read again the post when i said " I'M TALKING ABOUT OUT THE USA ".
vertx scooters
Member
Distributers to use or not
Riders
This is VertX Scooters adding our opinion to this very interesting thread. This is a question we have asking ourselves since we first harbored thoughts of marketing our products direct to you.
The first thing you need to understand is some of the companies mentioned do not manufacture their product. They source the manufacturing and label themselves as the manufacturer. This creates the first level of “mark-up” to the end user. As an actual manufacturer of the product it is our intention to bring the highest quality products to you at the most affordable prices. The aforementioned Ferrari or Aston Martin for the price of a “loaded” Ford. We can do this by removing the middle men that add nothing but cost to process your orders. We believe now that direct marketing is the way to accomplish that for customers in the USA. Overseas commerce changes the business model quite a bit. The two most important factors we see in doing business overseas are cost and time of delivery. We all know that shipping to individuals is not only expensive but can take quite a long time in transit. We believe the use of a distributor/warehouseman will be key in selling our products worldwide. Shipping in bulk to a distributor will significantly reduce the shipping costs per unit and offset the distributor “mark-up” to the end user. It goes without saying that the time in transit to the end user will be held to a minimum as the products are shipped locally.
We hope to have our web site www.vertxscooters.com up and operational in the next week or two. The distribution/warehouse point of distribution will come later. It is our goal to help grow our sport by making the highest quality parts available at lower prices so all can enjoy the experience. We look forward to hearing your thoughts on this or any other topic you may feel is relevant to helping the sport grow and evolve.
VertX
Riders
This is VertX Scooters adding our opinion to this very interesting thread. This is a question we have asking ourselves since we first harbored thoughts of marketing our products direct to you.
The first thing you need to understand is some of the companies mentioned do not manufacture their product. They source the manufacturing and label themselves as the manufacturer. This creates the first level of “mark-up” to the end user. As an actual manufacturer of the product it is our intention to bring the highest quality products to you at the most affordable prices. The aforementioned Ferrari or Aston Martin for the price of a “loaded” Ford. We can do this by removing the middle men that add nothing but cost to process your orders. We believe now that direct marketing is the way to accomplish that for customers in the USA. Overseas commerce changes the business model quite a bit. The two most important factors we see in doing business overseas are cost and time of delivery. We all know that shipping to individuals is not only expensive but can take quite a long time in transit. We believe the use of a distributor/warehouseman will be key in selling our products worldwide. Shipping in bulk to a distributor will significantly reduce the shipping costs per unit and offset the distributor “mark-up” to the end user. It goes without saying that the time in transit to the end user will be held to a minimum as the products are shipped locally.
We hope to have our web site www.vertxscooters.com up and operational in the next week or two. The distribution/warehouse point of distribution will come later. It is our goal to help grow our sport by making the highest quality parts available at lower prices so all can enjoy the experience. We look forward to hearing your thoughts on this or any other topic you may feel is relevant to helping the sport grow and evolve.
VertX
humpurple kushiones
Steel Member
Fist of all, dont tell that phoenix is the Ferrari of scooter lol
I just heard that they are made in YongKang, China
you heard wrong. made in usa.
theres a factory that makes phoenix wannabe parts, but not actually phoenix parts.
ztkAZ
Member
prooof.
humpurple kushiones
Steel Member
http://www.phoenixproscooters.com/faq.php
last question.
does that look like its in a big chinese factory to you? phoenix releases pictures of products being made and prototypes all the time. its ridiculously obvious they arent made in china.
american cars in the background with american plates. its not china. need more proof?
in conclusion, phoenix is like the ferrari of scooters.
humpurple kushiones
Steel Member
check out the pictures right above your posts taken in their warehouse in Oregon. its not chinese.
Ive seen the pictures but there old. Im talking about the new stuff that came out in the last year and upcoming products.
humpurple kushiones
Steel Member
the frame is also made in america...
if they are made in china which factory is it?
pictures of new hic bars from 4 days ago..
picture of non anodized decks from dec 17th. if they came from china, wouldnt they anodize them in china too?
pre-heat treating and anodizing. nov 17.
cores. oct 27
Riley Hughes
Steel Member
Distributors would raise the price of parts too much. Going from manufacturer, to retailer keeps the prices low. Torn Scooters is also wholesaling too. But using a distributor would simply raise the prices of parts and more of the money would go into the pocket of someone who is only the middle man... not someone who is putting the money back into making the sport bigger, and making better new technologies for parts (like I am.)
Now, seperate from torn scooters, i have something to add into the phoenix debate. i got an email from a guy in china who says that he manufactures phoenix parts and he wanted to manufacture torn bars, too. i just ignored the email because my parts will always be made in the usa. he has some pretty convincing pictures. also, i know they anodize and heat treat in the USA because i know the place they do both those things at.
http://www.apexanodizing.com/about_Apex_Anodizing.html
http://www.apexanodizing.com/type_2_II_anodizing.html
and they heat treat at a place i looked into getting parts heat treated at. here are some pictures from the email that "Keith Zhong", sales manager of Kui Zhou metal MFG factory in china, sent me.
they also sent me some pictures of cheap china wheels, and apex parts.
Now, seperate from torn scooters, i have something to add into the phoenix debate. i got an email from a guy in china who says that he manufactures phoenix parts and he wanted to manufacture torn bars, too. i just ignored the email because my parts will always be made in the usa. he has some pretty convincing pictures. also, i know they anodize and heat treat in the USA because i know the place they do both those things at.
http://www.apexanodizing.com/about_Apex_Anodizing.html
http://www.apexanodizing.com/type_2_II_anodizing.html
and they heat treat at a place i looked into getting parts heat treated at. here are some pictures from the email that "Keith Zhong", sales manager of Kui Zhou metal MFG factory in china, sent me.
they also sent me some pictures of cheap china wheels, and apex parts.
humpurple kushiones
Steel Member
Distributors would raise the price of parts too much. Going from manufacturer, to retailer keeps the prices low. Torn Scooters is also wholesaling too. But using a distributor would simply raise the prices of parts and more of the money would go into the pocket of someone who is only the middle man... not someone who is putting the money back into making the sport bigger, and making better new technologies for parts (like I am.)
Now, seperate from torn scooters, i have something to add into the phoenix debate. i got an email from a guy in china who says that he manufactures phoenix parts and he wanted to manufacture torn bars, too. i just ignored the email because my parts will always be made in the usa. he has some pretty convincing pictures. also, i know they anodize and heat treat in the USA because i know the place they do both those things at.
http://www.apexanodizing.com/about_Apex_Anodizing.html
http://www.apexanodizing.com/type_2_II_anodizing.html
and they heat treat at a place i looked into getting parts heat treated at. here are some pictures from the email that "Keith Zhong", sales manager of Kui Zhou metal MFG factory in china, sent me.
they also sent me some pictures of cheap china wheels, and apex parts.
ive seen those forks on the website they advertise on. they arent them im almost positive.
see how the front of the fork is flat? look at the one you posted, the circular section under the crown race looks like it goes all the way around. i cant really tell though. on the phoenix site it doesnt say anything about the forks being made in the usa...
but that deck picture looks very edited.
thats the original picture phoenix came out with when they first started, which we already established (the first ones) were definitely made in the USA. if you look at the headtube on the chinese one it looks like there are marks on the headtube that are completely identical to each other, anddddddddddd the little line under the headtube pointing to nothing but an obvious erase mark in the decks shadow...
too me it looks like some chinese factorys are trying to get people to believe they make genuine phoenix parts. i think phoenix should come in here to clear it up though.
Well we know that there a definitely lots of copies and i doubt phoenix would make it that easy to copy. The shitty part is that there is no copyright laws so any company can sell any design to anyone. Its hard to tell, but for the record i am not saying they do or dont, its just an interesting topic.
Riley Hughes
Steel Member
i personally choose to believe that phoenix parts are made in the usa, i think theyre a respectable company and love to buy from companies who make their parts in the usa... but i agree that it's an interesting topic.
about distribution :
1) Distributor is able to buy volumes from brands AND has a NETWORK of shops in their own countries that a brand cannot know
2) Distributors are able to react on the market as they are in the middle. A brand never can do that
3) A distributor knows if a shop is valid or not to sell a brand
4) Prices of goods will go down because of volumes that Distributors do
5) Direct selling from Producer to shops is falsh competition but also shows weakness of a brand as they are not able to do volumes or marketing
A DISTRIBUTOR IS NOT A SHOP !!! A DISTRIBUTOR IS A WHOLESALER.
A SHOP IS A DEALER OR A RETAILER !
1) Distributor is able to buy volumes from brands AND has a NETWORK of shops in their own countries that a brand cannot know
2) Distributors are able to react on the market as they are in the middle. A brand never can do that
3) A distributor knows if a shop is valid or not to sell a brand
4) Prices of goods will go down because of volumes that Distributors do
5) Direct selling from Producer to shops is falsh competition but also shows weakness of a brand as they are not able to do volumes or marketing
A DISTRIBUTOR IS NOT A SHOP !!! A DISTRIBUTOR IS A WHOLESALER.
A SHOP IS A DEALER OR A RETAILER !